Ed wrote:
>1. Just because a person is wearing a sign on his back that says "Kick me!",
that's no excuse for people to kick him.
>
>2. The Cunctator is right often enough that I continue to read all his posts.
Occasionally, I have even taken his advice.
1. I was being a lawyer, Ed: 'never ask a question you don't know the answer
to.' Thank you for making the point explicit. :-)
2. Of course he's often right. And I read all his posts except the ones on a
thread I've disconnected from.
kq
P.S. I'd post a diff to redeem this email, but wikipedia isn't responding.
Dear Friends,
Damn, this whole Lir thing is nasty. Rlee0001 just trashed KQ's user
page while KQ and Clutch were apparently off trashing Lir's user page.
I thoroughly approve of the banning of Lir, a troll's troll, but
dropping "examples of the kind of awful thing Lir would do if Lir were
still here" on Lir's own user pages is piling on. And so is jumping
all over KQ's user page to do the same back (if, indeed, that is what
KQ and Clutch have been doing, the edit audit and Recent Changes are
such a mess that Solomon couln't sort it out).
As regards Lir and all his/hers/its friends and enemies, in the wise
words of the grand old (copyright) song:
Please Don't Talk About Me When I'm Gone
Words & Music by Clare & Palmer
Please don't talk about me when I'm gone,
Though our friendship ceases from now on.
If you can't say anything that's nice,
Then best don't talk at all is my advice
We'll part and you go your way, I'll go mine,
It's best that we do,
Here's a kiss -- I hope that this
Brings lots of luck to you.
Makes no difference how I carry on,
Please don't talk about me when I'm gone.
Tom Parmenter
Ortolan88
I will be going with my wife and dauther to visit my parents for the
Thanksgiving holidays. We will be leaving here (Florida) on Tuesday
morning early, and returning the following Monday. My parents do have
broadband access, so I will be able to get online some, but I won't be
giving my usual daily attention to the mailing list.
I give a greenlight to sysops and developers to continue and extend
the ban on Lir to new i.p.'s, usernames, and the like, as necessary.
If this person continues to post in violation of the ban, then I'll
see what I can do to prevent this vandalism at the source. This
includes, if necessary, removing Lir from the mailing list in the
event of more smartass defensive remarks.
Try to avoid mistakes. :-) And try not to argue about it on the list.
I request that we all just take a little break from fussing about Lir,
Lir's user page, etc. I just protected Lir's user page, to give a
break from people feeling a need to fight about it. If Lir decides
not to continue at wikipedia in the future, we can just delete the
page permanently, so it really doesn't matter either way what is done
with it now.
> That page really doesn't seem conducive to civility either, though,
> really? Cunctator gets knocked around quite a bit. Decide for
> yourself if you think he deserves it--and Larry, you don't have to
> tell me what you think; but really he does. Which hatchet needs
> burying? Oh, there are two?
>
> kq
1. Just because a person is wearing a sign on his back that says "Kick me!", that's no excuse for people to kick him.
2. The Cunctator is right often enough that I continue to read all his posts. Occasionally, I have even taken his advice.
Ed Poor
Someone with IP addresses in the vicinity of 195.93.32.8 is creating articles
consisting only of someone's date of birth. I can't block it (it's
cluelessness, not vandalism, anyway) because it's an AOL proxy and he gets a
different address each time.
phma
Ortolan88 wrote:
>Sorry, KQ. I tried to be careful with that "apparently" and some
>other weasel locutions in the excised part, but as I also said the
>edit history and comments across many user pages were just too hard to
>follow.
>
>They shouldn't have done it to you.
>
>They shouldn't have done it to Lir.
>
>Nonspecific "they" meaning no one should be doing this.
>
>Tom P.
>O88
That's fine, and yes, I agree that it shouldn't be done.
kq
Erik,
Jonathan told me privately that he is Clutch. I'm not sure whether he has acknowldged this on the list or whether I should "out" him.
Why not e-mail him directly?
Ed Poor
-----Original Message-----
From: Erik Moeller [mailto:erik_moeller@gmx.de]
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 5:08 AM
To: wikien-l(a)wikipedia.org
Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] 129.186.80.133 (aka Lir)
Jon,
I do not know if you are Clutch, and frankly, I do not care, although I note
that you write these messages while simultaneously Clutch keeps vandalizing
the page. That you defend such an obvious violation is also strange.
Please don't use Wikipedia or the mailing lists for personal flamewars.
Wikipedia is not a playground.
Regards,
Erik
IP 129.186.80.133 popped onto Recent Changes. This IP is almost identical to
the one Lir was using when he was banned (just swap-out the last digit for a
0 and there you have it). Clutch also removed some excessive linking from an
article that this IP was working on and then Lir posted a message to
Wikipedia-L asking for some linking criteria. This IP then asked Clutch about
linking.
IMO this is an obvious attempt by Lir to subvert Jimbo's banning so I warned
this IP on user:Clutch's page but then the person continued to edit. I
therefore blocked the IP. If another sysop thinks this is in error then
please unblock the IP and state your reasoning here.
-- Daniel Mayer (aka mav)
The below edit is a large one and pays for my last message and this one;
http://www.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=Niobium&diff=0&oldid=442251
Ortolan88 Wrote:
>Dear Friends,
>
>Damn, this whole Lir thing is nasty. Rlee0001 just trashed KQ's user
>page while KQ and Clutch were apparently off trashing Lir's user page.
I wasn't trashing Lir's page; I was reverting it from what I
considered rather disrespectful writing that Clutch had made on it.
Check the revision history. Also, I was in process of discussing the
page with Clutch on [[user talk:Clutch]].
cheers,
kq